[Setup] Plone through Apache on Mac OS X 10.4 Server (Tiger) Problems

Kamal Gill kamal.gill at adaptivewave.com
Sat Apr 1 01:40:20 UTC 2006


Hello Tim,

Mark Murphy and Jim Roepcke (at Tyrell), would be the ones to contact  
regarding the decisions that went into building the OSX Installer, up  
to and including the 2.1.2 release.

My role was with putting together the 2.1.2 OSX installer in  
accordance with the conventions set by Tyrell in previous installers,  
as Jim was unavailable to put together the latest installer due to  
scheduling constraints.

And, for the record, I did propose some radical changes when I was  
offered the job by Tyrell to build the 2.1.2 installer, and many of  
my proposals were more in line with what you, Tim, expect the OS X  
installer to be.  However, the following reasons prevented me from  
implementing my changes for the 2.1.2 release.

1) Consistency, consistency, consistency.  Implementing a radical  
change in an installer for a minor point release is a bad idea, at  
least from a support perspective.  BTW, this is also the reason why  
Zope 2.7, not 2.8, was chosen for the 2.1.2 installer.

2) Tyrell subcontracted the work to me, so I had to comply with their  
requirements.

And, just to comment on your recommendation to install Plone at / 
Library...

If Plone is installed at /Library/Plone2, it would be completely  
wiped out during a reinstall of the OS.  This is not an issue for  
Apple's install of Apache, Tomcat, etc. since those are bundled with  
Mac OS X Server.  However, until Apple decides to bundle Plone with  
OS X Server, installing Plone at /Library is *not* recommended.   
Knowing where stuff should be installed is a difficult issue, as  
Apple doesn't really provide guidelines on where third-party server- 
side software should be.  The convention for client-side apps is at / 
Applications, so that's the convention Tyrell has decided to stick with.

When you mention that, "as you see it", the installer should be  
changed to comply with your recommendations, are those  
recommendations based on documentation at Apple's website?  If so, I  
would love to see those docs.  Please realize that I, and I'm sure  
Tyrell as well, as received *plenty* of recommendations on where the  
installer should place the files and folders that make up the large  
software stack that is Plone, and most of them are not consistent  
with your recommendations.  So, if you need an installer that puts  
the files where *you* want them to be places, my recommendation would  
be to hire me, Jim Roepcke, or anyone else that has experience  
putting together an OS X Installer for Plone, to build you a custom  
installer that contains what *you* think it should contain.

Now, since there's a chance that future versions of the OS X  
installer may *not* built by Tyrell, we would be free to implement  
the OS X Installer that "should have been", and in that case, I  
completely welcome your feedback on what should go into the installer.

And, for full disclosure, I am not affiliated with Tyrell in any way : )

  - Kamal

> On Mar 31, 2006, at 2:28 AM, Kamal Gill wrote:
>
>>
>> Misguided chap?  Ouch, that hurts! : )
>>
>> Actually, for the record, the 2.1.2 OS X Installer was put  
>> together to be consistent with previous versions of the installer,  
>> built by Tyrell.  If you have feedback or concerns about the  
>> installer, please contact the good folks at Tyrell and voice your  
>> concerns there, not here.
>>
>> And If you have feedback on what a "proper" OS X installer would  
>> be, I would be happy to hear it : )
>>
>> Best regards,
>> Kamal
>>
>> p.s. No offense taken
>
>
> 	O.K., I retract that statement.  But I have had several e-mails  
> with you concerning this, and you've pretty much stated you have no  
> intention of taking action on any of them.  As I see it, the  
> installer needs to be changed as follows:
>
> 1) Pone2 should be installed to /Library, not /Applications.  That  
> is where Apple has installed, Apache, Tomcat, JBoss, and  
> WebObjects.  That fairly clearly shows that to be the location  
> server software should reside.
>
> 2) Make the Default site and other sites not require separate  
> rewrite rules.  If for some reason this can not be done, clearly  
> document the need.  In the several e-mail exchanges we had where  
> had the same issue the original creator of this thread had, you  
> never once mentioned that separate rewrite rules would be needed.   
> It was only through trying every possible combination of rewrite  
> rule and VHM location that I finally got it to work.  I use  
> Apache2, not Apache1 on my server, so that may be why Daniel saw a  
> slight difference.
>
> 3) Allow for ZOE.  The documentation I have read states that ZOE is  
> the preferred means of Zope communicating with ZODB.  And al least  
> on of the products I want to use requires ZODB, as it has an  
> external process writing into ZODB; this is only allowed with ZOE.
>
>
> 	There is much to like about the installer, and I do prefer using  
> it over manual install.  I actually tried manual install, but ZODB  
> became corrupted after only one day of use.  As this has not  
> happened with the installer Plone, I'll stick with the installer.   
> The installer makes it easy to add additional sites to the system,  
> other than #2 above.  The script provided for this is a good  
> thing.  Installing external Python products works in most cases,  
> with the provided script installing it into the special structure  
> created by the installer.  I had one case where the installer did  
> not work for this, but did not troubleshoot to determine why.  It  
> was a ctags product which was a bit old.
>
> 	Anyway.  I do appreciate Kamal's efforts with the installer.  I do  
> realize how much work such things can take. Thanks Kamal.
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Setup mailing list
> Setup at lists.plone.org
> http://lists.plone.org/mailman/listinfo/setup

--
Kamal Gill - kamal.gill at adaptivewave.com
http://www.adaptivewave.com
Content Management Made Simple




More information about the Setup mailing list