[Product-Developers] ANN: plone-devstart (please help test)

Martin Aspeli optilude+lists at gmail.com
Sun Mar 11 08:46:36 UTC 2012

On 11 March 2012 06:58, Mikko Ohtamaa <mikko+plone at redinnovation.com> wrote:

>>     Last night while talking to Clayton and Liz about the whole
>> ZopeSkel/Paster/Templer/Crushinator situation it became clear that the
>> story for new developers is a complete mess.
>>     This is bad, and having a new shinny thing that "eases" Plone
>> development just made the situation even worse -- as long as someone must
>> use it and then <zopeskel create> & <paster addcontent>.
>>     Time to kill most of the available options, focus on **just one** and
>> have a compelling story to tell to newcomers.
> +1 for cleaning up the old stuff before inventing new stuff
>  A good step would be making buildout just work, as it is indented

Yay for stop energy. :-/

I want a solution that works now to a very specific problem: people expect
to be able to use an OS-managed/system Python to develop with Plone. And
when they try, their environment breaks in all kinds of hard-to-debug ways.

I don't want a framework or something with a million things that can go
wrong. plone-devstart is a dirt simple script using nothing but the Python
standard library. And, crucially, it scans the environment looking for
known/common problems.

I'm more concerned about the overlap with the installers, though that's a
slightly different discussion again.

The point is that *once you have a stable/clean environment*, you can have
all kinds of good tools. But if you can't get those tools to install or
run, you're screwed. Even if buildout should "just work" you still need to
install it. And you still need to worry about whether you have the right
Python version. And you may still be missing PIL C library dependencies, or
have a poisonous libxml2 killing lxml dead in your global library, or be
missing Python headers or a C compiler. None of those are within Buildout's
scope, and they are causing real problems for real people *today*.

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