[Product-Developers] Re: Where does it hurt?

Dylan Jay gmane at dylanjay.com
Mon May 19 01:49:55 UTC 2008

David Glick wrote:
> On May 18, 2008, at 6:24 AM, Martin Aspeli wrote:
>>> * Skinning
>>> Zope 2 vs. Zope 3 technologies
>> Yes - this is probably the top of my list to unify (and also very hard).
> I think the following efforts would take us 80% of the way in regard to 
> staunching some of the pain that new techniques have brought for 
> skinners (probably targetting plone 4?):
> - Add browser layer support to z3c.jbot and promote it as the 
> recommended way to do filesystem customization of resources registered 
> through ZCML (for those not familiar with jbot, this may sound like yet 
> another technology, but really it's a simplification.  It allows 
> customization of things like viewlet and portlet templates just by 
> placing a ZPT in the correct filesystem directory, so that it feels more 
> like a skin layer.)

For jbot to work it needs to work for templates on class views too as 
many mainly template views have a class to add in a tiny bit of logic. 
but since there are multiple ways to combine a template with a class 
view that is almost impossible right?

> - Devise a UI for through-the-web customization that unifies the skin 
> layer (portal_skins) and customerize (portal_view_customizations) 

why not get rid of skins all togeather? make browser resources work, 
move all plone code to use it and deprcate skins. It's very confusing to 
learn the difference between the two and very annoying to customise 
things in multiple different ways.
btw one way browser resources are harder than they need to be is that I 
can't take my working html mockup + css + images and drop in a directory 
and have it work.

> approaches.  (An entry-level skinner should not need to know *how* the 
> template they are customizing is registered; just where to find it.) 
> Ideally I think this would appear in the Plone control panel as opposed 
> to the ZMI, to be more approachable (I'm thinking of Wordpress' theme 
> editor.)  It's probably also a good idea to provide in-context links to 
> customize, (the proverbial Introspector, which I think Eric Steele has 
> modeled nicely in his branch of viewletmanager), but I think a 
> centralized place to see what customizations are active fulfills a 
> separate but important need.
> - Make it easier to export TTW customizations to the filesystem.
> If I'm reading Martin's 'Pete and Andy Try Plone 4' post correctly, this 
> is basically the scenario he's promoting there, so I don't know that I'm 
> adding a whole lot. :)  But I do think this is important, based on my 
> experience trying to teach 2 quite bright non-programmers how to skin 
> Plone 3.  Eyes do seem to glaze over if you mention ZCML, Generic Setup, 
> or (heaven forbid) the Zope Component Architecture...
> David Glick
> Project Associate
> ONE/Northwest
> New tools and strategies for engaging people in protecting the environment
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