<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div>I am<br><br>Sent from my mobile device</div><div><br>On Dec 4, 2012, at 9:18 AM, Nathan Van Gheem <<a href="mailto:vangheem@gmail.com">vangheem@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div>Everyone okay with meeting next week?<div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 2:34 AM, Roché Compaan <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:roche@upfrontsystems.co.za" target="_blank">roche@upfrontsystems.co.za</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">I'm already leaving for holiday on the 14th but would be available for<br>
a UI meeting next week.<br>
<br>
--<br>
Roché Compaan<br>
Upfront Systems <a href="http://www.upfrontsystems.co.za" target="_blank">http://www.upfrontsystems.co.za</a><br>
<div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5"><br>
<br>
On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 6:22 AM, Nathan Van Gheem <<a href="mailto:vangheem@gmail.com">vangheem@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
> I wasn't planning on a UI team meeting until the 18th. Is that too close to<br>
> Christmas? Tomorrow is too close although we do have good things to talk<br>
> about with all the work Thijs has done.<br>
><br>
><br>
> On Mon, Dec 3, 2012 at 6:19 PM, Rob Porter <<a href="mailto:robzonenet@gmail.com">robzonenet@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
>><br>
>> I will try this tomorrow. Speaking of tomorrow, are we meeting?<br>
>><br>
>> Sent from my mobile device<br>
>><br>
>> On Dec 3, 2012, at 6:39 PM, Thijs Jonkman <<a href="mailto:t.jonkman@gmail.com">t.jonkman@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
>><br>
>> Hi All,<br>
>><br>
>> Got an update on themes in <a href="https://dev.plone.org/ticket/13355" target="_blank">https://dev.plone.org/ticket/13355</a>.<br>
>><br>
>> I turned the three flavours of HTML5 Boilerplate into Diazo themes<br>
>> (several levels of difficulty). Try:<br>
>> <a href="https://github.com/TH-code/plonetheme.h5bp" target="_blank">https://github.com/TH-code/plonetheme.h5bp</a><br>
>><br>
>> This led me to mocking about with bootstrap a bit more. Try out:<br>
>> <a href="https://github.com/TH-code/plonetheme.bootstrap" target="_blank">https://github.com/TH-code/plonetheme.bootstrap</a><br>
>><br>
>> Have a go at them and give me some feedback :-)<br>
>> THijs<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> On Fri, Nov 30, 2012 at 10:01 PM, Dylan Jay <<a href="mailto:djay@pretaweb.com">djay@pretaweb.com</a>> wrote:<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> On 01/12/2012, at 3:08 AM, Nathan Van Gheem <<a href="mailto:vangheem@gmail.com">vangheem@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> On Fri, Nov 30, 2012 at 9:03 AM, Thijs Jonkman <<a href="mailto:t.jonkman@gmail.com">t.jonkman@gmail.com</a>><br>
>>> wrote:<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> Hi All,<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> (Thanks Nathan)<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> On Fri, Nov 30, 2012 at 3:02 PM, Nathan Van Gheem <<a href="mailto:vangheem@gmail.com">vangheem@gmail.com</a>><br>
>>>> wrote:<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> Hi all,<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> Could everyone review these plips and implementations and give some<br>
>>>>> thoughts. Thijs has already done some great work and I'm not sure the best<br>
>>>>> route to go here and I'd hate to waste too much of his time.<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> <a href="https://dev.plone.org/ticket/13355" target="_blank">https://dev.plone.org/ticket/13355</a><br>
>>>>> <a href="https://dev.plone.org/ticket/13358" target="_blank">https://dev.plone.org/ticket/13358</a><br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> What we're aiming for and thoughts:<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> - plone ship with default diazo theme<br>
>>>>> - so people has a very basic way to get started using diazo(they won't<br>
>>>>> have to create their own theme if they want to make some tweaks to move<br>
>>>>> elements around)<br>
>>>>> - should the theme still work without diazo? I think so.<br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>> I think we don't need to have the old and new style of the same theme.<br>
>>>> Reasons:<br>
>>>> - Avoid confusion for users (I have a sunburst theme under Themes and<br>
>>>> Diazo themes, what gives?)<br>
>>><br>
>>> The idea is it'd give people an easy starting point to modify the theme<br>
>>> via the diazo theme editor.<br>
>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>> - Maintain two nearly identical css codebases that achieve the same<br>
>>>> through different routes (not DRY)<br>
>>><br>
>>> Still keep all the css in the same spot--skins for now. Otherwise, we<br>
>>> don't get portal_css merging and everything.<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> We really need to come up with a way of doing merging that works better<br>
>>> with diazo. It doesn't make sense for the CSS to be so decoupled from the<br>
>>> theme.<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>> - Why have two ways to achieve the same goal?<br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>> I've created a sunburst and a classic one. I can see the classic theme<br>
>>>> being done old style and sunburst through diazo, showing both theming ways<br>
>>>> for people new to plone.<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> Why do you think the theme should work without Diazo? To not have<br>
>>>> plone.app.theming be obligatorily installed?<br>
>>><br>
>>> Yes. Think of all the people who have based their themes on sunburst and<br>
>>> now their themes will break unless they're forced into using diazo.<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> +1. We have a lot of diazo themes based on sunburst. Backwards<br>
>>> compatibility is really important. Same applies to skins. We need to<br>
>>> deprecate before we remove.<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>>> - should we still use skin layers? I think so.<br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>> I don't really see a reason for that with a Diazo theme either. Maybe<br>
>>>> for jbot fun? But if you're going that route for customization, you could<br>
>>>> add a browser layer. Or apply it to all of plone...<br>
>>><br>
>>> plone core shouldn't require the jbot package.<br>
>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>> Why should we use them?<br>
>>><br>
>>> Because everyone's current themes depend on it.<br>
>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>>> - migration and upgrades<br>
>>>>> - what package should we put the theme in? Would it be confusing for<br>
>>>>> plonetheme.sunburst to have normal theme and diazo theme?<br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>> I would move the plonetheme packages to a 2.0 version with Diazo themes<br>
>>>> and keep the old themes in the 1.x versions.<br>
>>><br>
>>> That's a possibility.<br>
>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> Ideas anyone?<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>> I think Plip 13358 needs to be roled into plone asap, Plip 13355 can<br>
>>>> definitely use some input :-)<br>
>>><br>
>>> Agreed.<br>
>>><br>
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>>><br>
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>><br>
>><br>
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